What makes you think McNair is unwilling to negotiate? Reese has done nothing to bring the parties together and work this out. He locked McNair from the facilities. If anything, this thing isn't moving because Reese isn't ready to make them move.flamehead2 said:
Release McNair today and $13.5 of that cap is STILL on the books.
McNair thinks he can be a #1 for another two or three seasons. Maybe it's realistic and maybe not but what future does he have in Tennessee when he knows he will become cut or the #2 in '07?
MacNine said:
nice scenario, but this is the NFL, we're talking millions of $$$ here, not a $50K raise.
if I were steve, i don't know what i'd do. but the titans were talking about picking a QB in the first round since january and at one point he did say he'd be happy to groom a kid like young and that he had a good friendship with him. and all of a sudden he says he's not so sure anymore. which is fine, steve wants (or thinks he can) play 2-3 more years. and if the titans draft young, young might be in the mix next year, which means he either accepts being a backup or asks to be released next year. then what happens? we tell him to go workout somewhere else. if I were steve, i'd be pissed too and i'd tell my agent to work out a trade. i'd want to be released. i'd be pissed. my problem with mcnair is never about the man or the player. it's about the contract. a contract which is where it's at cuz our gm doesn't know how to handle a cap. always puts all his eggs in the same basket. made a big mistake by giving fred miller a huge contract. made a big mistake by giving hopkins a huge deal. you don't give OL big money and then cut a star DE or a star CB so you can pay him. mcnair didn't put himself in this situation, floyd reese and jeff diamond did. look at seattle, they wanted to keep hutch, but eventually they decided it wasn't really worth it at $7 MIL a year, let him go and picked up a stud OLB and a pretty good WR with the money instead.
so do I want steve to be released or cut? for the money yes, but it'll suck real bad when it happens, because he is the guy i want running our offense this year and maybe next. yeah, he makes the mistakes now he used to make pre-'99, but so does favre. these guys aren't spring chickens anymore. i'll be sad to see steve go, just as i was sad to see samari and derrick go, and why? just cuz the nfl's salary cap, as nice as it is, is way too hard. 3 out of 4 sports leagues now offer "soft" caps, meaning you get penalized if you go over. ok, maybe a soft cap isn't really what the nfl needs, but still, they should consider it. if we had a soft cap now, i'm sure steve would be practicing with the guys now...
TitanJeff said:
If he thinks that why is he afraid to compete with Vince for the position?
We all know Fisher well enough to know he will play the best quarterback at his disposition and if that's McNair in 07, then Steve will play.
Problem is McNair doesn't want to compete for the job, he wants it handed to him on a gold platter...
It's rarelly about competition anymore. The pressure is on to play the guy you pay the big dollars to. If both McNair and Young are producing the same numbers, Young gets the nod because of the investment and the upside.Vigsted said:
But technically, you're right. McNair can pull a Brees and play so well that Young sits to '08. I'd be all for it because it would mean the Titans are doing well.
McNair knows the odds are against him in Tennessee unless he puts up '03 numbers and he knows he doesn't have the talent/experience around him to make that happen.
:yell: :cuss: :hot:Vigsted said:
Kiss my butt Steve McNair...
Even Drew Brees showed he was a competitor.
We saw what happen to him, but still... Fisher will play the man who gives us our best chance. All I ever hear is how Young is going to get hurt...
Not to mention people are very quick to remind us McNair is injury prone.
If McNair would re-evaluate his real worth and what what he means to this team and weigh it against what the Ratbirds really have to offer...
The choice is clear. McNair could be the Bledsoe that gets us past the AFC Championship and into the Super Bowl... (another bad example, I know) anyway... think of it... two star calibur QB's, every season... same style...
It's quarterback by committee in a way...
I'm sure it could be worked out somehow if the contract is scrapped.
I'm talking a long term deal. Young could go down like Mike Vick did.
McNair could stay and tap untold millions in Nashville commerce...
McNair could be on the roster here for years... He might play behind Young...
also Young might be the injury nightmare that McNair is...
Tennessee would be unstoppable in the future if we had two awesome qb's. McNair doesn't want the Super Bowl ring bad enough to approach it like that.
but noooooo!!!!
He can kiss my butt and get grap from the Ratbirds!
When Brian Billick wants you to be his QB, you know you're pretty much done.
Thanks for the memories Steve.
$0.02
Thanks for the memories Steve.
$0.02
There is no flesh left on this "dead horse" we continue to beat.......
However:
-For everyone that keeps saying that it is Floyd Reese's fault for re-negotiating McNair's contract so many times........
1) If he hadn't McNair would have been gone a long time ago. Everyone would have been screaming then as they are now.
2)McNair new this would happen eventually when he renegotiated so many times. Everyone knows it in this cap era.
3) Everyone keeps saying that McNair doesn't have the talent around him that he needs....that is why he renegotiated so many times...to get and keep a supporting cast. You can only do that for a player so many times.
- "He wants to play and start for several more years"....This is the same guy who talked of retiring no too long ago.
-There have been several people bring up that "Steve said in the hearing last week that he wants to stay here and retire as a Titan". Yep. That is what he told them. Notice he didn't ad into his statement at the hearing...."only if I get a long term contract and are guaranteed to start for several more years".
So....if you take him at his word as far as staying and retiring...HE COULD if he wanted. That is his call right now.
And for the constant argument of... "What if your boss wanted to make you take a paycut, and brought in someone new...."
Well, if my boss had paid me a HUGE amount of money over the years and then later I missed a ton of work, missed meetings (practice), was not the best at attending strategy sessions or taking any innitiative own my own as others do (extra time in the film room), kept talking about quitting in the past (talking of retiring), but then expected them to show loyalty after all of these things after they have brought in a new employee ("I want to stay and retire a Titan") after paying me enough money over the years that I would never have to work again...and oh yes... I UNDERPERFORMED for several "fiscal quarters"......
I just MIGHT take that paycut and stay for another year or two and return the favor and retire a TRUE ONE TEAM FRANCHISE LEGEND.
I will also add that I believe the league should have some allowance in the cap for that one "franchise" player so that a McNair, Montana, Emitt Smith, etc... can stay with the one team. The "Franchise Tag" in place now does not do that. With the players union, there is a minmum pay scale for veterans. Even if a player wanted to come back and was willing to take a really low amount....he is not allowed to by the union (I don't know the exact numbers or scale).
Everyone is entitled to their opinion.
Mine is that if you want to play the blame game..........
It's 50/50 50% Titans / 50% McNair (Okay, 50% Titans / 20% McNair / 30% Bus Cook)
However:
-For everyone that keeps saying that it is Floyd Reese's fault for re-negotiating McNair's contract so many times........
1) If he hadn't McNair would have been gone a long time ago. Everyone would have been screaming then as they are now.
2)McNair new this would happen eventually when he renegotiated so many times. Everyone knows it in this cap era.
3) Everyone keeps saying that McNair doesn't have the talent around him that he needs....that is why he renegotiated so many times...to get and keep a supporting cast. You can only do that for a player so many times.
- "He wants to play and start for several more years"....This is the same guy who talked of retiring no too long ago.
-There have been several people bring up that "Steve said in the hearing last week that he wants to stay here and retire as a Titan". Yep. That is what he told them. Notice he didn't ad into his statement at the hearing...."only if I get a long term contract and are guaranteed to start for several more years".
So....if you take him at his word as far as staying and retiring...HE COULD if he wanted. That is his call right now.
And for the constant argument of... "What if your boss wanted to make you take a paycut, and brought in someone new...."
Well, if my boss had paid me a HUGE amount of money over the years and then later I missed a ton of work, missed meetings (practice), was not the best at attending strategy sessions or taking any innitiative own my own as others do (extra time in the film room), kept talking about quitting in the past (talking of retiring), but then expected them to show loyalty after all of these things after they have brought in a new employee ("I want to stay and retire a Titan") after paying me enough money over the years that I would never have to work again...and oh yes... I UNDERPERFORMED for several "fiscal quarters"......
I just MIGHT take that paycut and stay for another year or two and return the favor and retire a TRUE ONE TEAM FRANCHISE LEGEND.
I will also add that I believe the league should have some allowance in the cap for that one "franchise" player so that a McNair, Montana, Emitt Smith, etc... can stay with the one team. The "Franchise Tag" in place now does not do that. With the players union, there is a minmum pay scale for veterans. Even if a player wanted to come back and was willing to take a really low amount....he is not allowed to by the union (I don't know the exact numbers or scale).
Everyone is entitled to their opinion.
Mine is that if you want to play the blame game..........
It's 50/50 50% Titans / 50% McNair (Okay, 50% Titans / 20% McNair / 30% Bus Cook)
TitanJeff said:
Honestly, he doesn't have 2-3 years of starting caliber play left in him- ANYWHERE he lands. I think it is sad that he, like Eddie, apparently doesn't realize his income potential extends far beyond his NFL contracts.
If I were Steve, I'd look to stay a titan at 4-5 mil/yr with guaranteed starts for 06 and 8 games in '-07 and be the back-up for 07/08. I don't think he, (or Bus-who doesn't get a cut) factor in the intangible revenue resources such as local endorsements, local enterprises (restaurants, sporting goods etc) that would extend his revenue production for YEARS after retirement. The Nashville community goodwill could be very lucrative over the long term.
I'd say 35% Titans, 40% Bus Cook, 25% Steve. Let's get something worked out and move on.
:applause: Look guys... I can't hang this all on Steve McNair...
I view anger as an irrational emotion... I admit...
For me to levy all the blame on Steve McNair is irrational...
but HOMER does not care. Homer want to vent.
Homer is not a fan of the Ravens...
So Homer wil Smack a future Raven...
Kiss my butt Steve McNair...
I've got to reserve my faith for Floyd Reese, Bud Adams, and Jeff Fisher...
They may be wrong... and they are...
but it is more important to forgive them.
I view anger as an irrational emotion... I admit...
For me to levy all the blame on Steve McNair is irrational...
but HOMER does not care. Homer want to vent.
Homer is not a fan of the Ravens...
So Homer wil Smack a future Raven...
Kiss my butt Steve McNair...
I've got to reserve my faith for Floyd Reese, Bud Adams, and Jeff Fisher...
They may be wrong... and they are...
but it is more important to forgive them.
MacNine said:
Your so called logic/principle doesn't make any sense. Beside the fact that McNair's salary takes something like 1/4 of the cap, he isn't performing like a prime QB anymore, so the pay cut is not only justified, but it's a logical step. I really doubt that you wouldn't be asked to take a pay cut or simply get fired if your performance decreases at your Burger King job.
I think that at some point (I hope) people will realize how pointless it is to keep comparing regular/common jobs to something like the NFL. No matter what some people make you believe, at the end of the day the NFL is nothing but a lot of players getting paid a lot of money to play a game. It is what it is. Unfortunately, some players don't understand that sometimes it helps to stop for a moment and see what is going on around you, and then you might realize how fortunate you are to have what you have right now - I'm not saying that McNair is greedy or not, because I don't know. I'm talking in general here.
I totally agree with you and felt for a long time that this was how it was going to play out. But you or I don't know what the Titans offered. According to rumors, it basically took the $10 mil he'd get this year and spread it out over a three-year deal and not guarantee him anything after '06.Riverman said:
What that means is he plays for $3.5 - $4 in '06 and is then gone. Why should he accept that when he has a contract now for $10 mil or gets $12 mil if he goes to Baltimore?
How can you be so down on McNair a 2 time pro bowler, CO-MVP, and took us to our one and only Super Bowl but dashes to the rescue of a guy who’s only way of going to Hawaii is on vacation (Albert if you do not know who I am talking about).
That just does not make any sense.
:sad2:
That just does not make any sense.
:sad2:
Riverman said:
I agree completly. I said about the same, with lower $$$, for EG. I don't understand why grown men cannot get this settled where everyone is a winner.
GoT said:
Pride?
Do you all seriously think McNair is that washed up? I think the addition of Givens a veteran receiver, White as a full back or big blocking back and almost a full year for that sternum injury to really heal, The Air apparent could play a solid season and could with some luck lead us to a 10 win season next year.
TitanJeff said:
I understood that they took the 10m he was to earn this season and gave it to him as a signing bonus which would have made all 10m guranteed.
skitch said:
your assessment of reese is wrong. why? he put himself, mcnair and the organization by giving the house to fred miller after losing runyan to free agency. a year later he panicked again, givng brad hopkins the house in fear of losing him too. then he gave up a first rounder for kevin carter, and in turn gave the house to carter too. offensive line is important, but you don't need to overspend to keep it afloat, which is what reese did.
hey, some will say he had to do it to protect mcnair, make sure george still had holes, we he went about it the wrong way. fred miller was a big dud in st. louis and he was with us too. where's miller now? picking fights with teammates. where's hopkins now?
in the nfl, you build through the draft and key fa signings without overpaying. david givens provides a dilemma. he's exactly the type of WR who is a good find on the FA market. but at his price? too expensive. the team will restructure his contract too, starting next year, and eventually he'll be cut too.
i just hope reese manages bulluck's salary well, cuz he'll cost big $$$ startin in 07. sirmon is sure to be cut next year when we start having some cap issues again.
if mcnair was worth $10 mil against the cap this year, we wouldn't even be talking here. there would be no steve mcnair can kiss my butt thread. but that's the reality of the nfl. salaries aren't guaranteed, but they can cause major headaches.
if only the rats-arses would've given us the 4th rounder, we'd have saved a whole lotta bs...
This is how it feels.
That was our time.
January 28, 2001 was my birthday... I spent it watching those stinking Ratbirds win our Super Bowl. :evil: We could have owned the Giants.
Now we are looking for Kerry Collins to come in.
Collins sucks!
It's not about players... It's about a team.
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