RollTide said:
Man it is great to hear someone who still supports Mcnair...He's our warrior....Remember the days when we had a terror defense to put us in positions to win games? 2006 season MVP - Steve Mcnair....Offensive Rookie of the Year - Brick Ferguson....YEAH BABY! :brow:
How many of you guys are married?
Imagine this scenario. A 40 year old man approaches his 39 year old wife and says honey, i have a younger replacement for you. She's a hot looking 22 year old babe but because she is inexperienced i would like you to mentor her for a year before you hit the road. What would she say? The same thing mcnair is saying now because that is exactly what we are doing with him. It's bullcrap!
How much you want to bet that d'mase is burring up the phone lines to billick and newsome telling them to get that guy! I guarentee you drew bennett thinks the exact same way about keeping him. You don't take a player of this quality and throw him away like trash. Mcnair did fine last year with what he had to work with. His passing rating last year was barely different than what it was in 2002 when many of you thought he was the MVP. That year he had mason-mccareins-bennett-dyson. This year his passing rating was just 1.6 points lower with less to work with. What is the difference?
Put mcnair on the cowboys, fags or panthers and tell me he couldn't have had similar numbers that bledsoe, delomme or leftwich had. You say he doesn't run that much any more? Well those guys never ran much. You think mcnair's passing rating could have been 7-8 points better with denver and that offensive line, rod smith and the running game? The broncos had two RBs who combined for almost 2000 yards and a 4.6 average. Mcnair has never operated in that kind of luxury even when eddie was here. The guy is still a good player and he never had that deer in the headlights look.
If steve goes whatever team he is on will be my second favorite team; even the ravens! If #9 is on the ravens i'll be a puke purple cheering mother and they could be a contender with #9!
Imagine this scenario. A 40 year old man approaches his 39 year old wife and says honey, i have a younger replacement for you. She's a hot looking 22 year old babe but because she is inexperienced i would like you to mentor her for a year before you hit the road. What would she say? The same thing mcnair is saying now because that is exactly what we are doing with him. It's bullcrap!
How much you want to bet that d'mase is burring up the phone lines to billick and newsome telling them to get that guy! I guarentee you drew bennett thinks the exact same way about keeping him. You don't take a player of this quality and throw him away like trash. Mcnair did fine last year with what he had to work with. His passing rating last year was barely different than what it was in 2002 when many of you thought he was the MVP. That year he had mason-mccareins-bennett-dyson. This year his passing rating was just 1.6 points lower with less to work with. What is the difference?
Put mcnair on the cowboys, fags or panthers and tell me he couldn't have had similar numbers that bledsoe, delomme or leftwich had. You say he doesn't run that much any more? Well those guys never ran much. You think mcnair's passing rating could have been 7-8 points better with denver and that offensive line, rod smith and the running game? The broncos had two RBs who combined for almost 2000 yards and a 4.6 average. Mcnair has never operated in that kind of luxury even when eddie was here. The guy is still a good player and he never had that deer in the headlights look.
If steve goes whatever team he is on will be my second favorite team; even the ravens! If #9 is on the ravens i'll be a puke purple cheering mother and they could be a contender with #9!
I don't see Mac going anywhere in '06 even if the Titans have to carry the full $23 mil cap number. He is the only hope the Titans have to challenge this season.
But McNair and Cook both know the odds for Steve to be as healthy at the end of this season (with possibly a second-year LT and RT protecting him all year) are slim. And they likely realize no one is going to give a three-year deal and a big bonus to a 34-year old, injury-prone QB who doesn't know the offense next March.
Maybe McNair goes out this season and looks like '03 and creates a demand. But nothing I've seen the last two seasons indicate that he is worth investing in long-term now.
That doesn't mean the team is throwing him to the wolves. They are paying the man $10 million to find a way to deal with the issue.
But McNair and Cook both know the odds for Steve to be as healthy at the end of this season (with possibly a second-year LT and RT protecting him all year) are slim. And they likely realize no one is going to give a three-year deal and a big bonus to a 34-year old, injury-prone QB who doesn't know the offense next March.
Maybe McNair goes out this season and looks like '03 and creates a demand. But nothing I've seen the last two seasons indicate that he is worth investing in long-term now.
That doesn't mean the team is throwing him to the wolves. They are paying the man $10 million to find a way to deal with the issue.
I'm over quoteing on purpose... Tide, I can't even read your post because the hook is such horse hockey...RollTide said:
In McNairs contract it clearly states...
to have and to hold from this day forward until death do us part...
C'mon Mr. Analyst... I thought my reasoning is nutty...
You are supposed to be a voice of reason on this board...
I expect more from you than that... You sound just as emotionally overblown as I do on any given day.
Yes, I'm married. The Titans are not married to McNair...
I'm subject to lose my job if my management is not happy.
That is what this is really about.
Jeff....sec...
Both your posts suggest that mcnair is not a good player. Management is not happy, nothing you have seen indicates blah blah blah. The guy had a bad year in 2004 because of the chest injury. Tell me what was wrong with him in 2005? Put jake plummer or drew bledsoe on that lame offense with no running game or wide receivers and see how they would do. Mcnair's supposedly bad play produced a passing rating 5 points higher than stud bledsoe has for his career and 8 points higher than hippie boy plummer. What i'm saying in a mild mannered way is that those who think mcnair wasn't any good in 2005 are clueless morons! If mcnair was mvp caliber in 2002 how could he suck in 2005 when his passing rating and TD-int ratio were almost the same playing with less talent?
If mcnair is over the hill aaron brooks must be ready for a nursing home because he couldn't carry steve's jock.
As far as long term i'm not talking about 5 years i'm talking about 2.
Both your posts suggest that mcnair is not a good player. Management is not happy, nothing you have seen indicates blah blah blah. The guy had a bad year in 2004 because of the chest injury. Tell me what was wrong with him in 2005? Put jake plummer or drew bledsoe on that lame offense with no running game or wide receivers and see how they would do. Mcnair's supposedly bad play produced a passing rating 5 points higher than stud bledsoe has for his career and 8 points higher than hippie boy plummer. What i'm saying in a mild mannered way is that those who think mcnair wasn't any good in 2005 are clueless morons! If mcnair was mvp caliber in 2002 how could he suck in 2005 when his passing rating and TD-int ratio were almost the same playing with less talent?
If mcnair is over the hill aaron brooks must be ready for a nursing home because he couldn't carry steve's jock.
As far as long term i'm not talking about 5 years i'm talking about 2.
Getting lazy?
If you are as good at your job as mcnair is at his there would be no reason for management to be unhappy. That's the point.
SEC 330 BIPOLAR said:
If you are as good at your job as mcnair is at his there would be no reason for management to be unhappy. That's the point.
The issue is that Mac wants to be paid like a top QB still while his production does not warrent it. Yes he had a good yr, but that still had him ranked 17th in terms of QB rating. I think that Mac is our best bet for getting to the playoffs in the next 3 yrs and hope that they can come up with a contract that doesn't overpay Mac and also protects the Titans. Why give him a contract that guarantees him 18mil over the next couple yrs when we could just franchise him for the next 2 yrs if we need to. The cost wouldn't be that much different and if he got hurt or retired we wouldn't be stuck taking a cap hit.
Good points RollTide... Since long term is 2 years we should draft DE Mario what's his name... I don't get agents... Do they represent actual thoughts or do they just BS through the media? Yesterday Bus related to all of us as if McNair felt that drafting... just forget it. The past two seasons I've been looking for something... Don't catagorize me like I'm really out for blood... I'm just trying to look at the situation for real... I maintain that I do not want McNair to go... I'm really with the fitantitans mentality on this. I want McNair to be the boat load of gold you are selling him as just as much as everyone... but there comes a time when the realization is made that it is in everyones best interests that the transition begins. If McNair contractual demands are too great then the hand of the FO is forced. That is not what I want. Tennessee really needs McNair IMO, but there are 52 other guys that have got to make this thing work. If we were a 9-7 team last year I'd agree 100%... I'm looking to the future... Our best shot at winning anything at all is with McNair... Sure, I'd like to think that VY can go out and win 12 games as a rookie... but that is just the polar opposite of your disposition. I think we should have them both even if we have more money at qb than anyone else in the league.
Last year you predicted that McNair was going to storm into the playoffs...
get real Mr. Analyst... he did look like a lost deer in the headlights at times and I'm sure there are many that may take exception to being dismissed as clueless morons. I'm not saying that he was never good at all during the season. In fact it was Gunny and me that were smack returning Mr. E the hell out of here while all you did was ***** and moan... It's all good... but we weren't even a spoiler last year... CONTENDER!!! whatever... we couldn't spoil fresh chicken in the noon day sun last season.
do like the Jagcat nickname though... that's funny...
Last year you predicted that McNair was going to storm into the playoffs...
get real Mr. Analyst... he did look like a lost deer in the headlights at times and I'm sure there are many that may take exception to being dismissed as clueless morons. I'm not saying that he was never good at all during the season. In fact it was Gunny and me that were smack returning Mr. E the hell out of here while all you did was ***** and moan... It's all good... but we weren't even a spoiler last year... CONTENDER!!! whatever... we couldn't spoil fresh chicken in the noon day sun last season.
do like the Jagcat nickname though... that's funny...
You have to assume a lot to think I don't feel Mac is a good player. I don't feel that way at all. Is he what he once was? Nope. But I'm not going to kid myself in thinking with his injury history he can be counted on to lead this team beyond '07.RollTide said:
And not to sound like a broken record, do you want to toss a rookie into the mix in '08 when the rest of the team is ready to make some serious noise towards the Super Bowl? If want McNair your starter in '07, that's what you are asking for.
It's the same reason you don't bring back Hopkins even if you think he'd do a little better than Roos. It's the same reason Pacman started ahead of Beckham. This team needs experience at key positions.
Do I need to post again your comments from last year when you told us all McNair was done?RollTide said:
Don't let the numbers get into the way of what you saw last year. McNair isn't the same QB he was in '03 (even if he had the weapons) and should not be part of any plans the Titans have beyond '07. Though he's the best chance the Titans have of playing winning football the next two seasons, things have to be kept in perspective.
Bullcrap jeff...
First of all the comparison i made was mcnair in 2002 not 2003. 2003 was an atypical year for him. The stats point out an obvious fact that mcnair's play was relatively typical compared to what he has done most of his career and i would rather look at the numbers than rely on some lame observations.)
Just because i blew up a couple of times when he made a mistake doesn't mean anything. He fumbled the ball in the end zone and gave the raiders a free TD. So? Most of last year i defended him.
Mcnair's passing rating in 2005 was better than it was in 97, 98, 99, similar to what it was in 2000 and 2002. Considering the support he had why would i consider him done?
I own a tape of the music city miracle game when mcnair circa jan 2000 at age 26 and 11 months looked weak and ineffective throwing the ball. Was that because of age?
Give me a letter grade for the following areas of this team in 2005.
RBs
O-line
WR
D+ across the board or worse? Yet steve had what is historically a typical year for him passing the football.
Swap mcnair for many quality QBs and he puts up similar stats on those other teams. It's not a stretch at all to think that mcnair could have put up the 87 passing rating throwing to steve smith that delomme put up at carolina. Mcnair couldn't be effective in that denver offense? How about the seahawks? The colts? The bengals? I'm not saying he is top shelf any longer but he still is pretty good.
First of all the comparison i made was mcnair in 2002 not 2003. 2003 was an atypical year for him. The stats point out an obvious fact that mcnair's play was relatively typical compared to what he has done most of his career and i would rather look at the numbers than rely on some lame observations.
) Just because i blew up a couple of times when he made a mistake doesn't mean anything. He fumbled the ball in the end zone and gave the raiders a free TD. So? Most of last year i defended him.
Mcnair's passing rating in 2005 was better than it was in 97, 98, 99, similar to what it was in 2000 and 2002. Considering the support he had why would i consider him done?
I own a tape of the music city miracle game when mcnair circa jan 2000 at age 26 and 11 months looked weak and ineffective throwing the ball. Was that because of age?
Give me a letter grade for the following areas of this team in 2005.
RBs
O-line
WR
D+ across the board or worse? Yet steve had what is historically a typical year for him passing the football.
Swap mcnair for many quality QBs and he puts up similar stats on those other teams. It's not a stretch at all to think that mcnair could have put up the 87 passing rating throwing to steve smith that delomme put up at carolina. Mcnair couldn't be effective in that denver offense? How about the seahawks? The colts? The bengals? I'm not saying he is top shelf any longer but he still is pretty good.
I believe that pretty much is stating the obvious and kills any reason to continue discussing the subject with you.RollTide said:and i would rather look at the numbers than rely on some lame observations.
As long as McNair has a supporting cast, he can get the job done. The past 2 or 3 years he has not had anyone around him. With the moves they've made so far, they have put themselves in shape to contend. Now why would you draft a QB and throw a Rookie out there now? Draft the Brick, the biggest hole on the team (MLB close 2nd). Draft a MLB in the second and boom, you have a team that can make a run at the playoffs and beyond IMO. McNair sounds motivated to regain his form, he is not over the hill yet, Titans can't give up on him yet. He deserves at least one more year to prove hes still got it with help around him.
If Steve didn't want to retire he should have never mentioned it. Once he did he became unreliable. They have to draft a QB for a couple reasons; first, Bud says so, secondly, they've got to look to the future and that goes beyond two years which is what they would expect Mac9 to play for. They probably won't have a pick this high for a long time so they need to get their guy now.
rcarie...
That is nonsense. His retirement talk was the result of pain and frustration over an injury. An injury that has been surgically repaired and healed.
Not once during the 2005 season has he talked of retirement.
That is nonsense. His retirement talk was the result of pain and frustration over an injury. An injury that has been surgically repaired and healed.
Not once during the 2005 season has he talked of retirement.
Steve in 99 and 2000...too old?
In 99 and 2000 steve mcnair had passing ratings of 79 and 83 respectively. I'm rounding off. That's an average less than his 2005 number. Remembering those years i recall quite a bit of frustration over steve and our passing game. Steve wasn't a kid any longer and many people myself included expected him to be a more dominant passer. Still he was a top 10 QB but our passing game was not outstanding.
Remember in 2000 when we lost that opening game at buffalo and steve didn't play well? And then he was not very effective at all against the chiefs and left the game with the sternum injury. Neil had to come in and lead us to a TD drive that kept us from starting the year 0-2.
Later that year i attended a game against the raiders on a sunday night. Steve was not sharp at all and there were collective moans through thre crowd in frustration. This is the 27 year old version of mcnair. We won the game because eddie ran for almost 200 yards and the defense stopped rich gannon.
The point here is a simple one. Steve mcnair at 27, even with eddie in his prime and a great defense struggled in some of the same ways as this year.
An interesting stat comparison.
Steve ages 26 and 27 in 99 and 2000
27 TDs-21 ints a ratio of 1.285
Steve age 32, 2005..supposedly old, feeble and past his prime.
16 tds-11 ints a ratio of 1.454
How could that be? Without eddie? Without mason?
In 99 and 2000 steve mcnair had passing ratings of 79 and 83 respectively. I'm rounding off. That's an average less than his 2005 number. Remembering those years i recall quite a bit of frustration over steve and our passing game. Steve wasn't a kid any longer and many people myself included expected him to be a more dominant passer. Still he was a top 10 QB but our passing game was not outstanding.
Remember in 2000 when we lost that opening game at buffalo and steve didn't play well? And then he was not very effective at all against the chiefs and left the game with the sternum injury. Neil had to come in and lead us to a TD drive that kept us from starting the year 0-2.
Later that year i attended a game against the raiders on a sunday night. Steve was not sharp at all and there were collective moans through thre crowd in frustration. This is the 27 year old version of mcnair. We won the game because eddie ran for almost 200 yards and the defense stopped rich gannon.
The point here is a simple one. Steve mcnair at 27, even with eddie in his prime and a great defense struggled in some of the same ways as this year.
An interesting stat comparison.
Steve ages 26 and 27 in 99 and 2000
27 TDs-21 ints a ratio of 1.285
Steve age 32, 2005..supposedly old, feeble and past his prime.
16 tds-11 ints a ratio of 1.454
How could that be? Without eddie? Without mason?
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