Sox Please Click the URLs
Ok lets see if they followed protocol then. Lets see if they are kicking themselves or were they following the data and performance shown according to the Senior Bowl results and the Combine results. Now this is non-biased phylosophy, believe it or not. My phylosophy is they wanted a cornerback and the best one available at that point in the draft according to all the data provided. By the way I have seen some of the data that none of you have, i.e. the actual highlight tape shown to the different NFL teams, GMs, Coaches, prepared by my brother and his agent. Now for the the data, the URLs showing the combine results and numbers (Clearly show Andre as the 3rd ranked corner that year and the Senior Bowl players of the game URL... All key things used in the decision process. After you go to the URLs, then decide if Brian's point is valid....I'll save you some time, but please go there any way... His point is non-valid.
http://www.seniorbowl.com/2006/gamerecaps2000s.htm
2003
NORTH 17, SOUTH 0
MVP: Larry Johnson, Penn State
NORTH COACH: Dom Capers, Texans
SOUTH COACH: Marty Mornhinweg, Lions
TOP PLAYERS: Carson Palmer, Kyle Boller, Marcus Trufant, Andre Woolfolk, Michael Haynes, Larry Johnson
Not even Heisman Trophy winner Carson Palmer of USC could lead the South to victory in the 2003 Senior Bowl, as the North's dominating defense pitched just the second shutout in the game's 54-year history to win 17-0 in front of the game's ninth straight sellout crowd in Ladd-Peebles Stadium. A pair of Penn State stars led the way for the Yanks, as Defensive MVP Michael Haynes recorded a sack, forced two fumbles and broke up a pass, and college football's premier running back in 2002 -- Larry Johnson -- earned the game's overall MVP Award. Trailing 10-0 in the fourth quarter, the South threatened to the close gap after penetrating to the North eight- yard line. But Notre Dame's Shane Walton stepped in front of a Chris Simms pass and raced a Senior Bowl record 99-yards with the interception for a touchdown to seal the North victory. The contest also featured one of the game's most talented rosters ever. In addition to Palmer, who became the second Senior Bowl player in as many years to be the first overall selection in the NFL Draft, a record-tying 14 members of the North and South squads were selected in the first-round of the draft three months later.
Above is te Senior Bowl History/Recap, please scroll down to 2003 when viewing that URL. Below is the Combine Results for Corners.
Pro Football Weekly's Official Combine Results/Rankings for Cornerbacks
http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/NFLDraft/Draft+Insider/2003/Printout2CB.htm
Rk.
Name
College
Ht.
Wt.
Sp.
Gr.
Com.
1
Newman, Terence
Kansas State
5103
189
4.38
6.55
Age, RS
2
Trufant, Marcus
Washington State
5111
199
4.44
6.45
3
Woolfolk, Andre
Oklahoma
6013
197
4.48
6.10
WR
4
Wilson, Eugene
Illinois
5103
187
4.49
6.00
RS
5
Davis, Sammy
Texas A&M
5116
186
4.46
5.80
6
Weathersby, Dennis
Oregon State
6005
204
4.38
5.60
MI, X
7
Asomugha, Nnambi
California
6023
210
4.38
5.50
S
8
Garrett, Kevin
Southern Methodist
5093
194
4.32
5.50
9
Florence, Drayton
Tuskegee
6002
198
4.44
5.41
10
Groce, DeJuan
Nebraska
5095
192
4.50
5.30
RS
Soxcat said:
Ok lets see if they followed protocol then. Lets see if they are kicking themselves or were they following the data and performance shown according to the Senior Bowl results and the Combine results. Now this is non-biased phylosophy, believe it or not. My phylosophy is they wanted a cornerback and the best one available at that point in the draft according to all the data provided. By the way I have seen some of the data that none of you have, i.e. the actual highlight tape shown to the different NFL teams, GMs, Coaches, prepared by my brother and his agent. Now for the the data, the URLs showing the combine results and numbers (Clearly show Andre as the 3rd ranked corner that year and the Senior Bowl players of the game URL... All key things used in the decision process. After you go to the URLs, then decide if Brian's point is valid....I'll save you some time, but please go there any way... His point is non-valid.
http://www.seniorbowl.com/2006/gamerecaps2000s.htm
2003
NORTH 17, SOUTH 0
MVP: Larry Johnson, Penn State
NORTH COACH: Dom Capers, Texans
SOUTH COACH: Marty Mornhinweg, Lions
TOP PLAYERS: Carson Palmer, Kyle Boller, Marcus Trufant, Andre Woolfolk, Michael Haynes, Larry Johnson
Not even Heisman Trophy winner Carson Palmer of USC could lead the South to victory in the 2003 Senior Bowl, as the North's dominating defense pitched just the second shutout in the game's 54-year history to win 17-0 in front of the game's ninth straight sellout crowd in Ladd-Peebles Stadium. A pair of Penn State stars led the way for the Yanks, as Defensive MVP Michael Haynes recorded a sack, forced two fumbles and broke up a pass, and college football's premier running back in 2002 -- Larry Johnson -- earned the game's overall MVP Award. Trailing 10-0 in the fourth quarter, the South threatened to the close gap after penetrating to the North eight- yard line. But Notre Dame's Shane Walton stepped in front of a Chris Simms pass and raced a Senior Bowl record 99-yards with the interception for a touchdown to seal the North victory. The contest also featured one of the game's most talented rosters ever. In addition to Palmer, who became the second Senior Bowl player in as many years to be the first overall selection in the NFL Draft, a record-tying 14 members of the North and South squads were selected in the first-round of the draft three months later.
Above is te Senior Bowl History/Recap, please scroll down to 2003 when viewing that URL. Below is the Combine Results for Corners.
Pro Football Weekly's Official Combine Results/Rankings for Cornerbacks
http://www.profootballweekly.com/PFW/NFLDraft/Draft+Insider/2003/Printout2CB.htm
Rk.
Name
College
Ht.
Wt.
Sp.
Gr.
Com.
1
Newman, Terence
Kansas State
5103
189
4.38
6.55
Age, RS
2
Trufant, Marcus
Washington State
5111
199
4.44
6.45
3
Woolfolk, Andre
Oklahoma
6013
197
4.48
6.10
WR
4
Wilson, Eugene
Illinois
5103
187
4.49
6.00
RS
5
Davis, Sammy
Texas A&M
5116
186
4.46
5.80
6
Weathersby, Dennis
Oregon State
6005
204
4.38
5.60
MI, X
7
Asomugha, Nnambi
California
6023
210
4.38
5.50
S
8
Garrett, Kevin
Southern Methodist
5093
194
4.32
5.50
9
Florence, Drayton
Tuskegee
6002
198
4.44
5.41
10
Groce, DeJuan
Nebraska
5095
192
4.50
5.30
RS
I've seen you sell this before, and I'll buy it. Sure, Andre hasn't lived up to his draft day expectations...Myself personally, I expect any 1st day pick to go out there and be the real deal. Some think there is a big difference between a 2nd and 3rd...I look at it as two fold...top of the draft and bottom. When you start getting fine it just gets too scientific, and no matter how much statistical information you lump in you really can't make a science out of a crapshoot.WoolfolksUncle said:
Anyways, like I was saying...selling this again is pointless...It's all out of some stupid remark...Brain pecked out a sentence or two, and although he didn't make you mad which was likely his aim as Soxcat so thoughtfully pointed out, he still managed to get you to go through all the trouble of putting that post together...a smidge off topic I might add. The Andre Woolfolk discussion should be closed for the time being until there are new games to be played.
I realize that is like asking Ricky Lake to lay off the bon-bons but Woolfolk this and Woolfolk that is getting to be really lame. I'm not going to sit here and drill it like I did last week to some pathetically tired end but I'm here. Just like I said I would be. I'm sick of watching the poison pill be dropped.
SEC 330 BIPOLAR said:
Agreed..... What I would really love to see is Brian, Soxcat, RollTide, and TexMexTitan (something like that) all agree and I will gladly stick to other topics.... It doesn't take me too long though.... Google is wonderful... you think.
Brian said:
Hey that smiley normally claps, is clapping here, but not in the original post.
:bonk2:
WoolfolksUncle said:
maybe this has something to do with it. ...... ?
Are you TexMexTitan? Funny, you don't really say a whole lot. Have you been fragging Woolfolk too? I've never seen you say anything like that and I spend WAY too much time reading this damn message board.Mex#1TitanFan said:
Arguing about Woolfolk is like arguing about the a Super Bowl that has yet to been played. You can't prove the future. Woolfolk has a future with this team. It is only a question of how long it is.
Puck said:
A Puck, begging for inclusion on the list of those that can't leave it alone. I guess that is like a puck begging to not be the item whacked in a hockey slapshot.
The item that enters the net to the sound:yell2: SCORE
Wow, What job securityLike BiPolar was saying, can you leave it alone until the season or are Pucks just too small of items to hear, oh, I am sorry, Pucks don't have ears, or in the case of this board....eyes. Or am I wrong. Now this proposal for a new avatar suggests that one thing pucks have is Job security and not just for being whacked by a hockey stick:
View attachment 1500
Whhhooooo hoooooo! Job Security
WoolfolksUncle said:
You can post all the 40 times, shuttle times, how good he looks in a swim suit and every experts rankings but the fact is after 3 years there are a bunch of players Reese wishes he had taken instead.
Soxcat said:
You said fact. That is an interesting word. Did Floyd Reese have a personal conversation with the amazing Soxcat??? Was it on the Radio, in the paper, on television maybe. A fact is something you definitely know and I really doubt you remotely know Floyd Reese. Maybe you should say you strongly believe. Now here is a FACT. In my post, I said at the time he was drafted that the Titans must have had their minds set on a corner. Key words - At the time. According to all the times, etc., which you continue to downplay.... Once again - AT THAT TIME, Andre was the best corner available per all the tools utilized to make the pick.
Now, I will ask again, because everyone else seems to be in agreeance. Can you just chill out buddy. Now why would I respond to you then ask you to chill. Well why do some parents take their kids in a Candy Store and say, don't ask for a thing. Stay in the store for 1/2 hour then get upset when the kid goes ballistic saying, pleeeaassseee, pleeeeaaassseee
andre was best size/speed ratio guy, not the best corner. fact is we took a gamble on someone who had only played a full year at corner and it didnt pay off. we all knew it was a boom or bust pick.
the DBs taken after AW n the first round were sammy davis, nnamdi asomugha. charles tillman, eugene wilson, rashean mathis(my personal favorite) were taken in the second roucd and asante samuel was taken in the fourth round.
i'd say i would much rather have tillman, mathis or samuel over AW. andre just isnt very good.
this just proves you can't get all caught up in the size/speed ratio. i think we've fallen in love with big guys who run fast, instead of guys who play football.
the DBs taken after AW n the first round were sammy davis, nnamdi asomugha. charles tillman, eugene wilson, rashean mathis(my personal favorite) were taken in the second roucd and asante samuel was taken in the fourth round.
i'd say i would much rather have tillman, mathis or samuel over AW. andre just isnt very good.
this just proves you can't get all caught up in the size/speed ratio. i think we've fallen in love with big guys who run fast, instead of guys who play football.
WoolfolksUncle said:
We do all agree. We all agree that picking a guy in the first round that will be lucky to play NB next year for us is a bad way to get to the SB.
bigtitan53279 said:
You talk like he makes no plays at all. That is a flat out lie and anyone that wants to stake their case, then do so. While your at it stake the cases where all those guys you just mentioned missed a play or two. The fact is Andre's worst games of the year were vs future hall of famers and a bunch of you found the scapegoat to point at. While he was hurt and after he returned all the defensive backfield was torched from hill to pac to the safeties. In particular, the miami game, no passes were completed against andre playing in the slot, but no one mentions that. In the same game hill and pac were burned repeatedly. Your statement in reverse must be saying he can't play football. You're flat out wrong buddy. Yes, injuries have derailed him and even this year, his best game was the one he got hurt in vs fitzgerald, who had 2 catches for a net of 7 yards vs Andre and right after his injury lit up waddell for 81 yards and 2 tds. In that game Andre had 3 pds in the first half alone, five solo tackles. He was playing a heck of a game. I mentioned it on this board during the game and all of the spiteful criticizers stayed away. Spiteful about a dismal losing season. Ok, you might knock him for his injuries, but don't talk like he can't play a lick of football. I won't stand by and accept that garbage.... period. Like I have stated before, he knows how to work incredibly hard during the off season and I am sure he is now. This is the first healthy off season he has had during his Titans tenure. Come training camp, when he starts shoving all of the negativity down the doubters/haters throats. I will come on this board and help him shovel it back in your faces.:irked:
Soxcat said:
You need to agree that one guy did not keep this team from the super bowl and get over your own ego and drop the nonsense. The people agreed to look to the future, this draft coming. Does that help you or are you too blind inside of your signature pics bag.
bigtitan53279 said:
One thing that has been proven time and time again in recent years - from Woolfolk to Calico to Bob Sanders to Pacman is that height is the most over-rated measurable of any draft prospect. Having receivers that can't separate and Defensive backs that can't cover, but a team of players who are great in jump ball situations does not make for good football players.
WoolfolksUncle said:
You act like there is some kind of conspiracy against him here. Fans want their team to win. I'm sure everyone here would be thrilled if he came in and won the starting job and made the pro bowl. We just haven't been given a reason to believe he will yet. You can't ride the potential card your entire career. Eventually you have to come out and earn your spot from the next hot thing.
If WoolfolksUncle doesn't think Reese wishes he had that pick back he is smoking something. IMO it is simple for Andre. Go out and prove all of us wrong on the football field. Be the stud we drafted him to be. Then I would be the first to give the guy props. Nobody cares at this point about combine numbers. What we care about is having better players on the field than the team we are playing. Andre might not be the only reason this team has stunk the last two years but he certainly has done his fair share. As a first round pick a player is counted on to be not just a starter but a solid starter, an anchor for the team for years to come. Right now he looks like a wasted pick. Only Andre can do something about that.
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