Well, I'd let him go ONLY if we were first approached by another team and it was for a 3rd or higher. A second, with the holes we have, I'd have to say bye-bye (cuz I'm thinking impact LB or S).
As far as using Kinney as a FB, he can do everything but run well. Running is not his strong suit.
As far as using Kinney as a FB, he can do everything but run well. Running is not his strong suit.
If we're going to keep Steve, we should keep Kinney for another reason. Steve is very comfortable with Kinney as a go-to guy on some important plays, and Kinney is probably more of a safe bet than anyone else on our team to catch the ball in coverage. He may not be very fast, but he's big and he's got hands. I'd hate to see him go, and I don't see anyone knocking the door down for him...
Do you guys agree that Kinney has the lowest upside between Bo and Ben Troupe?
Kinney had his most productive season of his career with over 500 yards on 55 catches. There were times when he was basically our whole offense.
Kinney is also 6'6, 275 pounds and one of our biggest problems to solve is to revive our running game. Getting rid of the best run blocking TE IMO is not a good idea. I say we stay pat at TE. We have versatility and depth with the guys we have and one less hole to try to fill.
Kinney is also 6'6, 275 pounds and one of our biggest problems to solve is to revive our running game. Getting rid of the best run blocking TE IMO is not a good idea. I say we stay pat at TE. We have versatility and depth with the guys we have and one less hole to try to fill.
Lowest upside between Bo and Ben Troupe? No way, I'll even go a little too far and say he has the highest upside and is the most valuable of all three to the team. I don't really even see any argument to how Bo could have more of an upside than Bo Scaife. The arguements for him against the other two are the same, but Ben Troupe is a better candidate to compete against him, so I'll argue that. Kinney has 6 years of experience, with Steve as his QB. In an offense where Steve is dealing with mostly new receivers, having someone he can count on in 3rd down situations is important. I don't even know how to get the stats on it, but think about the season. I remember tons of important drops by Troupe, including at least 2 for TDs in the last 2 or 3 weeks. I know Kinney has some, but in general I feel like he's got more solid hands, and makes the catches that hit his hands. Troupe looks like he has some great potential, but we know Kinney has the skills. We need blocking desperately, and Kinney is our best blocking TE. Kinney's got 2 inches on Ben Troupe, and just always seems to fall forward. I've definitely seen Troupe tackled and knocked backward quite a few times this year, and I can't remember seeing it with Kinney. Bo still hasn't really shown that much. He had some bad drops around the middle of the year, but a lot of his catches were dumps at the line of scrimmage for 1, maybe 2 yards. I feel like we see most of Kinney's catches in the 6-11 yard range. Kinney's YPC average is higher than both of the others, not much ahead of Troupe, but Troupe tore off a couple for long yards that pad his stats. Troupe's possible benefit is that breakaway capability, which I'll agree is great and I can't wait to see more of him. But at this point with our team, I think we've got to keep Kinney.
:applause:Soxcat said:
I have no idea why anyone would want to get rid of one of the more productive players on the team.
The Titans don't face the cap issues they had last offseason.bigreese82 said:
TitanJeff said:
To make room for a guy who could be more productive? And we have depth there? Now that's only if we got a good pick for him that could be used to help another position. Does that sound crazy?
Who is more productive? Troupe? He'll have as many opportunities as the #2 since he is a totally different weapon than Kinney is. Kinney is the best blocker on a team needing help with the running game. Until Scaife is more consistent with his game, I don't think you get rid of Kinney since the Chow offense utilizes the TE so much.Bobo said:
If Gunther was a big hulky type guy looking at moving Kinney might have more merit. Scaife and Troupe don't fall into that category and Kinney is not only a real solid blocker he is a pretty darn good offensive weapon.
I see know way we could get value in a trade for Kinney.
Again this idea that draft picks are automatically an improvement over solid proven NFL players has raised its ugly head. Kinney is a very valuable player on our team (as Jeff said we have an offense that utilizes the TE alot) and it is sensless to trade him for a 3rd round pick that has never played a down in the NFL. To come close to his value we would have to get a mid to early second round pick and nobody is going to do that IMO and even if they did we could still end up coming out on the short end.
I see know way we could get value in a trade for Kinney.
Again this idea that draft picks are automatically an improvement over solid proven NFL players has raised its ugly head. Kinney is a very valuable player on our team (as Jeff said we have an offense that utilizes the TE alot) and it is sensless to trade him for a 3rd round pick that has never played a down in the NFL. To come close to his value we would have to get a mid to early second round pick and nobody is going to do that IMO and even if they did we could still end up coming out on the short end.
TitanJeff said:
I said Troupe could be more productive, and being the #1 guy will give him more opporitunites to do so. Even when we ran two TE sets, sometimes Troupe wasn't in. It's pretty obvious the kind of playmaking TE that Troupe can be and Kinney will never be. Yeah we'll give up some blocking, but to get a better play maker in and a draft pick that could help elsewhere....doesn't seem like too much of a risk to me.
We shouldn't use the TE so much, that's part of the problem. Wr's should be more of the game plan, even Fleming should be.
Sox, I've already said this before, but I'll say it again. I'm not saying a draft pick is automatically better than what Kinney does. Of course there's some risk involved. Kinney is not a 2nd round talent. He's good, but helped a lot by the system.
Bobo said:
Very good post!!! Kinney could be shopped for another player if a draft choice wasn't good value. I would love have a decent veteran safety
or even OL help. You can always find a blocking TE in the late rounds of the draft. You always can kind one of those. We already have two possibly three good receiving TEs. I say three because the 4th TE has upside because he was kept on the roster over more needy positions.
You have to make tough choices but again, what are the odds on Kinney having another season like this one.
Sell High is the rule..
Jolley had interest from several teams and Oakland got value. Kinney could be used to move up in the draft, for simply a draft choice or for a proven player at a need position
I'm split on the issue of trading Kinney. I think he is a good all-around TE and a good blocker. In that respect, there's no reason to trade him. He is a better blocker than our other TEs.
That said, like Bobo mentioned, Troupe needs playing time. We had no receiving threats on offense this year, and Troupe is a potential threat. He needs to be the #1 TE. Kinney just doesn't have the athleticism to be that threat.
I'm not opposed to keeping both. But if they are high enough on Scaife (and I don't see why not) and Guenther to be the #2 and #3 TEs, then Kinney could be moved to get a draft pick. Trading Kinney for (perhaps) a 3rd round pick may be preferable to either cutting Guenther or keeping him inactive if they like him.
That said, like Bobo mentioned, Troupe needs playing time. We had no receiving threats on offense this year, and Troupe is a potential threat. He needs to be the #1 TE. Kinney just doesn't have the athleticism to be that threat.
I'm not opposed to keeping both. But if they are high enough on Scaife (and I don't see why not) and Guenther to be the #2 and #3 TEs, then Kinney could be moved to get a draft pick. Trading Kinney for (perhaps) a 3rd round pick may be preferable to either cutting Guenther or keeping him inactive if they like him.
None of the other TEs have shown they can be a consistent force in the run blocking scheme that the Titans have used. If the Titans trade a TE, it will be Scaife or Guenther, maybe Troupe(if the price is right)bigreese82 said:
It's not just a case of keeping the best player. It's also what you get in return. What do you think we are going to get in return by trading Scaife or Guenther?
If the Titans trade any of them, it would be Kinney. He's the one with both solid trade value and a guy who isn't going to get any better.
If the Titans trade any of them, it would be Kinney. He's the one with both solid trade value and a guy who isn't going to get any better.
What percentage do the Titans run a two-TE offense now? It may be difficult to know due to the injuries but we already know Chow uses it often.
I just think the Titans need two quality TEs and Scaife is not ready to be a #2.
And I don't see Troupe being effective as a TE who had to pose a duel threat which I feel is Kinney's strength. I think Troupe is actually more effective with Kinney on the field as he can split out and exploit mismatches.
Let's also remember there is more wear and tear on Troupe if he has to stay in as a blocking TE.
Lots to consider here.
I just think the Titans need two quality TEs and Scaife is not ready to be a #2.
And I don't see Troupe being effective as a TE who had to pose a duel threat which I feel is Kinney's strength. I think Troupe is actually more effective with Kinney on the field as he can split out and exploit mismatches.
Let's also remember there is more wear and tear on Troupe if he has to stay in as a blocking TE.
Lots to consider here.
It seemed Scaife was the #2 TE this year at times when he was in instead of Troupe. He looked good with his chances. They felt good enough about Guenther to keep him as a 4th TE (they didn't even do that with what's his face that went to Atlanta). They have to feel pretty good about the TE depth.
Indy relies a lot on TE's and they let Pollard go because they liked what they had behind him.
Indy relies a lot on TE's and they let Pollard go because they liked what they had behind him.
- Status
- Not open for further replies.
