Vigsted said:
OK- he didn't run a pro-style offense but he did run one that won games. I'd have to look up how many times McNair was in the shotgun during the 02,03 runs- but I'm guessing it was a high percentage. My point is, I'm not sure it really matters what kind of offense he ran in college in regards to how effective a QB he could be in the NFL.
His ability to read defensive schemes is speculation, not fact.
The problem is that college is nothing like the NFL and just because you're winning in college doesn't mean you'll be good in the NFL. Just ask the likes of Eric Crouch.
Vigsted said:
Agreed. It is speculative, as are the arguments that Cutler or Leinart's game will translate into a better NFL game as well. I just haven't seen any objective points other than mentioned above that suggest Young is a bigger draft risk than the other two.
Vigsted said:
Vigsted,
(Slightly off topic here). I was wondering do you ever feel like writing up your arguments in like a word document and then just pasting them in everytime someone brings up the same discussion again and again?
) Thats not really meant to be a dig at anyone, btw. Just a comment on how it seems like no matter how different a thread may start out or how well a previous thread is debated, they seem to be coming back to the same argument again and again. [Ex(shouldnt use team stats to compare abilities, nfl and college are different, trust titans staff over posters opinions,best player available vs team need, chow coached ML. Mcnair mentors VY, etc, etc, etc)] :wall: :stars:
Any way we could all vote and have the draft tomorrow?
no. we can't vote and do the draft tomorrow.
It's not like anyone else has been able to make a case for Young.
Young, IMO, lately... seems to get no love. I'm at the point now where I like them all so much. Leinart was who I liked during the season and then I gravitated to Young. Now I think Jay Cutler is awesome. We could draft any of these I guys. I don't think I'd care. I see a tremendous upside to Young, but I'm scared of him. BP hasn't seen Riverman in a while so mail in the post tomorrow because it's refreshing to see a post in support of Young. He could be the biggest draft pass-up since Randy Moss.
It's not like anyone else has been able to make a case for Young.
Young, IMO, lately... seems to get no love. I'm at the point now where I like them all so much. Leinart was who I liked during the season and then I gravitated to Young. Now I think Jay Cutler is awesome. We could draft any of these I guys. I don't think I'd care. I see a tremendous upside to Young, but I'm scared of him. BP hasn't seen Riverman in a while so mail in the post tomorrow because it's refreshing to see a post in support of Young. He could be the biggest draft pass-up since Randy Moss.
Riverman said:
I like what you say there. I'd still take Young out of the three. He's got the poise, he's ahead of where Vick was at the same point in time, and he will work hard to prove people wrong.
They are all risks, but I think Young will be more than fine in the NFL, and this Wonderlic score is just bad press. Bad management to not prepare him, but, in the end, he scored a 16. Marino did as well, and I would take that. Young and Leinart's stock will rise again after their workouts and interviews. In the end, the ride is going to be more fun with Vince Young than the other two, and so I still lean toward him. I won't be mad with anyone else we draft, but I'm still loathe to take Cutler at #3. Sorry. You can interview well and place just for showing up, but I still don't feel his stock is that high. Now if Cutler came out last year with the same kind of hype, I'm sure he'd go #1 overall next to Alex Smith, but this is now. He should still go in the top 10, maybe even #4, but if he's the first QB taken overall by us, I'll be mighty surprised. Even if we like him a bunch, I don't see how we won't take a trade down opportunity if one presents itself as long as we still get a QB in the process.
GLinks said:
No doubt. This may really be why I want to see him in two-tone blue.
Draft Day is REALLY going to be exciting this year.
BTW, Thanks GLinks and SEC 330 BP for the comments and the obvious effort you make to understand posts before you respond.
Then you're not paying attention. Try turning your computer off, reading a paper, listening to a sports talk show. It's all you hear....."Young is a better athlete than he is a QB". That's risky.Riverman said:
Brian said:
Well that's objective and not full of speculation. :sad2:
BTW: This might be hard for you to believe, but even though we haven't actually seen the needle sticking out of his ***, some of us speculate that Barry Bonds has taken steroids.Riverman said:
I'd the answer to who is the best is up to everyone's personal opinion. But I'm sure we'd all agree Leinart is the most NFL ready.
Riverman said:
Riverman, Young is a Hard-sell, because he doesn't make much sense.
Despite all the flaws that folks will point out, he just keeps getting better. Most of the speculation that you speak of, comes from people who don't step back and look at the entire picture, they see or hear about a piece of his game, and draw conclusions from there.
For what it is worth GBN has Cutler going #3 to the Titans and Leinart and Young falling.
If we take Cutler it won't be at 3. We will trade down if we want him.
Young...
We will find out more with young's pro day. Right now i'm partial to him. Maybe i'm nostalgic for the good old days with mcnair or something.
With young we will need mac to committ to 2 years because young might not be ready after one. Even carson palmer sat a year and was just mediocre his first time out in his 2nd year.
The three best prospects in this draft are not QBs. Mario williams is the best prospect in this draft in my opinion. Bush would be second with dbrick third. None of these three guys are the same caliber prospects that carson palmer was or even david carr for that matter.
All three have issues. Lienart has questions about arm strength and whether he was carried along in part because of superior talent around him. Young has the obvious adjustment issues and the 3/4 delivery and cutler has some mechanics issues and wasn't as dominant at the college level.
Mario williams is the best player in this draft.
We will find out more with young's pro day. Right now i'm partial to him. Maybe i'm nostalgic for the good old days with mcnair or something.
With young we will need mac to committ to 2 years because young might not be ready after one. Even carson palmer sat a year and was just mediocre his first time out in his 2nd year.
The three best prospects in this draft are not QBs. Mario williams is the best prospect in this draft in my opinion. Bush would be second with dbrick third. None of these three guys are the same caliber prospects that carson palmer was or even david carr for that matter.
All three have issues. Lienart has questions about arm strength and whether he was carried along in part because of superior talent around him. Young has the obvious adjustment issues and the 3/4 delivery and cutler has some mechanics issues and wasn't as dominant at the college level.
Mario williams is the best player in this draft.
Every player in the draft has question marks around them. Even Mario, the question about his effort on the field and in practice. I disagree that he is the best player in the draft.
Mario's effort on the field...??
He was more of an impact his jumior year than julias peppers was. Maybe he was just dogging it with those 14 sacks and 24 tackles for loss but that just illustrates how incredible he is.
Who is a better prospect except maybe bush? Jay cutler?
He was more of an impact his jumior year than julias peppers was. Maybe he was just dogging it with those 14 sacks and 24 tackles for loss but that just illustrates how incredible he is.
Who is a better prospect except maybe bush? Jay cutler?
theprizdfighter said:
So if we have Cutler rated as the #1 QB in the draft we are going to trade down to draft him? If we have Leinart or Young rated higher than Cutler then we wouldn't trade down either because we would stay put and get the guy we want. Bottom line is I don't see us trading down unless we don't have confidence in any of the three.
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