Let’s see for starters...
The time travel rules make no sense. According to Tilda’s character, Banner needs to make sure the stones are returned at the same point in time yet in the same scene she says that each time jump creates an alternate timeline. When they leave with the stones, that timeline now continues without the stones. Cap’s return with the stones just means there’s now ANOTHER timeline.
How did Cap And Stark jump to get the tesseract and the Pym Particles from 2012? They didn’t have enough Pym Particles to jump back to the present and then go further back in time. If they could just jump times at will, what exactly was the point of the van and the other giant Quantum Realm device?
They didn’t solve the Thanos problem. He’s still very much alive in multiple timelines. The only one he no longer exists in is the 2014(?) timeline that he jumped from. It seems like they went all out to fix one timeline without thinking how bad they may have fucked up all of the other timelines.
Thanos’s power seems dependent on how convenient it is for the plot as well is the power of Thor’s axe.
The time stone could have kept Tony alive. Thanos rewound time in IW to kill Vision but it didn’t rewind everyone. They could have rewound time enough to have someone else that was capable of harnessing the power actually do the snap.
Dr Strange’s one outcome sure did depend on a lot of dumb luck. Thanks mouse!
Also the apparent mass production of Pym Particles for Thanos’s army seems pretty convenient.
Side note: Really nice of Hawkeye to keep his dead wife’s phone service on and keep it charged for 5 years.
The time travel rules make no sense. According to Tilda’s character, Banner needs to make sure the stones are returned at the same point in time yet in the same scene she says that each time jump creates an alternate timeline. When they leave with the stones, that timeline now continues without the stones. Cap’s return with the stones just means there’s now ANOTHER timeline.
How did Cap And Stark jump to get the tesseract and the Pym Particles from 2012? They didn’t have enough Pym Particles to jump back to the present and then go further back in time. If they could just jump times at will, what exactly was the point of the van and the other giant Quantum Realm device?
They didn’t solve the Thanos problem. He’s still very much alive in multiple timelines. The only one he no longer exists in is the 2014(?) timeline that he jumped from. It seems like they went all out to fix one timeline without thinking how bad they may have fucked up all of the other timelines.
Thanos’s power seems dependent on how convenient it is for the plot as well is the power of Thor’s axe.
The time stone could have kept Tony alive. Thanos rewound time in IW to kill Vision but it didn’t rewind everyone. They could have rewound time enough to have someone else that was capable of harnessing the power actually do the snap.
Dr Strange’s one outcome sure did depend on a lot of dumb luck. Thanks mouse!
Also the apparent mass production of Pym Particles for Thanos’s army seems pretty convenient.
Side note: Really nice of Hawkeye to keep his dead wife’s phone service on and keep it charged for 5 years.
I’m sure there’s more that I haven’t had time to think about. These are the ones that I thought of while watching the movie.
There's extensive interviews with the directors and screen writers that fully explain the holes.
A lot of it will be addressed in future films and shows.
Strange viewed 14 million scenarios so of course a lot of random things had to happen for them to win in the end.
Thanos is far more advanced than Pym and very intelligent. Replication of the Pym particles is no big deal. The tech gap between the earth bound hero's and cosmic peeps is and always has been extremely far. Thanos would exist in infinite realities if that's how the MCU works but we don't know that as of now. Thanos probably wins in trillions of those timelines but it doesn't matter to the main MCU timeline which we follow where the Avengers won.
The timeline would've come back together after the stones were returned to their place. Bald ancient lady literally explained that. The audience assumes that Cap did exactly that.
The only discrepancy is there's a timeline where Thanos and his entire army no longer exist and Loki is still alive and a timeline where Cap married Peggy and lived an entire life so there'd be two Caps in that timeline.
I'm betting Cap went back to the timeline that 2014 Thanos came from and lived his life in that one considering after the Thanos attack on NYC in Avengers 1 there'd be no greater threat coming besides Ultron which maybe doesn't happen if Hydra doesn't exist, maybe Cap goes back to the late 40's and stops Hydra from infiltrating Shield to begin with. He'd know the future and could change a lot of bad outcomes in the 40's and 50's.
At the end of Endgame he returns to his own timeline and gives Falcon the shield possibly staying there because in all timelines Peggy dies in like 2014.
So really there are only two timelines, possibly three at the end if we assume Cap did what he said he would.
1. Main MCU timeline
2. Cap growing old with Peggy timeline
3. Loki gets the tesseract and disappears timeline
I don't think #3 happens though because cap would return the tesseract to that timeline before the scenario where Loki ends up with the cube therefore that never happens to begin with.
So really only two.
If the Avengers had failed in Endgame there'd be a dozen different timelines but they didn't and the audience is to assume Cap returned everything to where it belonged.
I think Thor was not at full Ragnarok/Infinity War power. He'd been living as a fat drunk playing Fortnite for five years. He had PTSD and was a mess. He was a broken character.
As for the time stone Russo explained at a Q&A because someone asked that. Basically the only way they win and Thanos stays gone for the future and forever is for Tony to remain dead. Tony's death is likely necessary for other events to take place in the universe that Strange knows about and no one else does.
If he tells people the future he knows then the results change which is why he never directly tells Tony how they will win. Strange is a dues ex machina character. He will always know the future up until his own death which he cannot see past.
A lot of it will be addressed in future films and shows.
Strange viewed 14 million scenarios so of course a lot of random things had to happen for them to win in the end.
Thanos is far more advanced than Pym and very intelligent. Replication of the Pym particles is no big deal. The tech gap between the earth bound hero's and cosmic peeps is and always has been extremely far. Thanos would exist in infinite realities if that's how the MCU works but we don't know that as of now. Thanos probably wins in trillions of those timelines but it doesn't matter to the main MCU timeline which we follow where the Avengers won.
The timeline would've come back together after the stones were returned to their place. Bald ancient lady literally explained that. The audience assumes that Cap did exactly that.
The only discrepancy is there's a timeline where Thanos and his entire army no longer exist and Loki is still alive and a timeline where Cap married Peggy and lived an entire life so there'd be two Caps in that timeline.
I'm betting Cap went back to the timeline that 2014 Thanos came from and lived his life in that one considering after the Thanos attack on NYC in Avengers 1 there'd be no greater threat coming besides Ultron which maybe doesn't happen if Hydra doesn't exist, maybe Cap goes back to the late 40's and stops Hydra from infiltrating Shield to begin with. He'd know the future and could change a lot of bad outcomes in the 40's and 50's.
At the end of Endgame he returns to his own timeline and gives Falcon the shield possibly staying there because in all timelines Peggy dies in like 2014.
So really there are only two timelines, possibly three at the end if we assume Cap did what he said he would.
1. Main MCU timeline
2. Cap growing old with Peggy timeline
3. Loki gets the tesseract and disappears timeline
I don't think #3 happens though because cap would return the tesseract to that timeline before the scenario where Loki ends up with the cube therefore that never happens to begin with.
So really only two.
If the Avengers had failed in Endgame there'd be a dozen different timelines but they didn't and the audience is to assume Cap returned everything to where it belonged.
I think Thor was not at full Ragnarok/Infinity War power. He'd been living as a fat drunk playing Fortnite for five years. He had PTSD and was a mess. He was a broken character.
As for the time stone Russo explained at a Q&A because someone asked that. Basically the only way they win and Thanos stays gone for the future and forever is for Tony to remain dead. Tony's death is likely necessary for other events to take place in the universe that Strange knows about and no one else does.
If he tells people the future he knows then the results change which is why he never directly tells Tony how they will win. Strange is a dues ex machina character. He will always know the future up until his own death which he cannot see past.
Actually I thought about my last point. The Infinity Stones are gone therefore the time stone no longer exist in the main MCU timeline so Strange can no longer view the future. I assume he'd have previous knowledge of coming events though and looked past Tony's death before he gave the Time Stone to Thanos in Infinity War.
Of course maybe he never saw past Tony's death and Strange is flying blind in the MCU now which is probably better and he's no longer overpowered and all knowing.
Of course maybe he never saw past Tony's death and Strange is flying blind in the MCU now which is probably better and he's no longer overpowered and all knowing.
As indicated by BttF2, if you go back to before the timeline is fractured or split, there is no problem. That plothole doesn't exist. Next.
They had enough Pym Particles for 2 trips - one going back in time and one returning. They used their second batch to go back to the 70s to get the Tesseract and more Pym Particles so they could return home. THAT plothole doesn't exist. Next.
The third one is a good question, but they just want to reverse the snap, so their end goal wasn't to get rid of Thanos.
Thanos power was something I was curious about... but a theory I found on it was that in Infinity War, Thanos didn't wear his armor and wasn't trying to kill the Avengers... he was, to an extent, pushing them out of his way to get the stones. In Endgame, he was straight up pissed and in total kill mode. So, that would make a big difference.
But who? Even Hulk got fucked up reversing the snap. If they reversed time, wouldn't that undo Tony's snap and return the Thanos and his army? Now, possibly Strange, so I'll give this one a push!
A LOT of things depend on luck... he looked at millions of possible outcomes. I doubt they'd do an entire film based around the other outcomes that failed. Plus, that mouse probably accidentally triggered that thing in about 1000 possible outcomes. So... yeah? Not a plothole... Next.
The shrinking of Thanos' ship and army... frankly, we don't know what he is capable of with Nebula's dose of Pym Particles. We don't know how it works, because they shrunk vehicles with people inside with no problem in Ant-man and the Wasp. I'll give this one a bit of a push.
Not sure about the phone service, either... but that didn't bother me because it was so minute and almost irrelevant to the plot. Honestly, if they'd cut that out... no one would have noticed.
They had enough Pym Particles for 2 trips - one going back in time and one returning. They used their second batch to go back to the 70s to get the Tesseract and more Pym Particles so they could return home. THAT plothole doesn't exist. Next.
The third one is a good question, but they just want to reverse the snap, so their end goal wasn't to get rid of Thanos.
Thanos power was something I was curious about... but a theory I found on it was that in Infinity War, Thanos didn't wear his armor and wasn't trying to kill the Avengers... he was, to an extent, pushing them out of his way to get the stones. In Endgame, he was straight up pissed and in total kill mode. So, that would make a big difference.
But who? Even Hulk got fucked up reversing the snap. If they reversed time, wouldn't that undo Tony's snap and return the Thanos and his army? Now, possibly Strange, so I'll give this one a push!
A LOT of things depend on luck... he looked at millions of possible outcomes. I doubt they'd do an entire film based around the other outcomes that failed. Plus, that mouse probably accidentally triggered that thing in about 1000 possible outcomes. So... yeah? Not a plothole... Next.
The shrinking of Thanos' ship and army... frankly, we don't know what he is capable of with Nebula's dose of Pym Particles. We don't know how it works, because they shrunk vehicles with people inside with no problem in Ant-man and the Wasp. I'll give this one a bit of a push.
Not sure about the phone service, either... but that didn't bother me because it was so minute and almost irrelevant to the plot. Honestly, if they'd cut that out... no one would have noticed.
So if changing the past doesn't affect the future then Loki will end up with two Tesseract's
as explained in the movie, any change creates an alternate timeline
Murphy's Law pretty much insinuates that there already is a timeline in which every possible scenario that can happen will and does happen in another reality. New realities can't be created if every possible timeline has already happened. Of course the translation on that law can be interpreted different ways so I'm not saying this with absolutism.
its a comic book movie, they make it up as they go. But they do explain
BttF also claims you can’t interact with your past self without messing everything up. Let’s not pretend BttF is Marvel canon. Cap’s last jump back has to create an alternate universe but it seems the writers and directors disagree on that. Time travel is complicated and this movie muddies itself like all the others.
I understand they used their Pym Particles designated to return to the present to shrink but that doesn’t explain how they got to 1970. What did they use to get to 1970? They didn’t have the van or Bruce’s device. Shrinking doesn’t just allowed them to suddenly jump time. Maybe I’m missing something but that didn’t make sense. Does Tony’s GPS bracelet thing just allowed you to time jump as you please?
I understand they used their Pym Particles designated to return to the present to shrink but that doesn’t explain how they got to 1970. What did they use to get to 1970? They didn’t have the van or Bruce’s device. Shrinking doesn’t just allowed them to suddenly jump time. Maybe I’m missing something but that didn’t make sense. Does Tony’s GPS bracelet thing just allowed you to time jump as you please?
Yea, don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to distort the entertainment for the sake of getting things right. They based some of the story on their own interpretations and that is fine. The movie would of been good regardless of what they did.
Will lead into his upcoming series.
I believe the big device was more of an anchor and the braceletbrwere the tethers.
I used BttF as an exanple... but the reality is that time travel is theoretical and there are many out there. Like zombies... not every variation is the same because they don't exist as a template to use.
I used BttF as an exanple... but the reality is that time travel is theoretical and there are many out there. Like zombies... not every variation is the same because they don't exist as a template to use.
So this trailer answers some questions and asks more
The snaps tore a hole in the universe and people are coming through? Mysterio is from another earth. Is Marvel/Sony going full on Spiderverse???
If the plot turns out to be true what if we get a post credits scene of Tom Hardy's Venom entering the MCU. Woo boi.
Also Miles Morales was hinted at being a very young kid in Homecoming and if he didn't get snapped he'd be early teens in the current MCU...
If the plot turns out to be true what if we get a post credits scene of Tom Hardy's Venom entering the MCU. Woo boi.
Also Miles Morales was hinted at being a very young kid in Homecoming and if he didn't get snapped he'd be early teens in the current MCU...
Probably going to be a convenient way to get Deadpool into the MCU as well since Disney already confirmed he's the only XMen property not being rebooted.
At the end of Deadpool 2 he was already jumping through time so him randomly popping out into the MCU post snap with some dimension shenanigans would be okay
At the end of Deadpool 2 he was already jumping through time so him randomly popping out into the MCU post snap with some dimension shenanigans would be okay
The "endgame" here is probably to put Spider-Man into Sony's universe. Disney doesn't want any more of Sony's stuff. Marvel is only making one more Spider-Man for Sony, then it's totally in Sony's hands.
These tips will probably be a way to move Spider-Man into their universe.
I don't know. Apparently Sony was pretty happy with the arrangements and the talk was to extend it with rumors that the person illuded to working behind the scenes in Antman and the Wasp and Homecoming and also the buyer of the Avengers tower... Norman Osborn. Dark Avengers was also in the works. The idea that Norman Osborn comes in and becomes like the Evil Tony Stark is interesting.
Originally Sony wanted Venom in the MCU. This would be an easy way to include him or like you said move Tom Holland to the Sony Universe.
If they do ideally he goes away and Miles Morales becomes the MCU Spider-Man. Love it.
But Disney isn't making anything off Spider-Man movies. The arrangement was for Marvel to use Spider-Man in those MCU movies... Marvel would make 3 Spider-Man movies for Sony to make the money on, then that's it.
Unless they are about to do a full renegotiation, it isn't happening.
Also, of course Sony is happy with the arrangement... they get to make the money without being failures creatively.
Man whoever wrote and directed the Spiderverse movie needs to be handed the keys to all their Spider-Man stuff. They killed it.
One has to wonder how long Tom Holland wants to play this role also. He's done five movies so far within like four years. I'm sure the money is nice but most people don't do it forever.
Let Sony take Peter Parker back and negotiate a deal to hold on to Miles for a decade or so.
Or maybe Disney just buys failing ass Sony Pictures and the family is together again.
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