And Andy Reid went to a 2-14 team and took them to the playoffs. Maybe that means Reid wasn't the problem?
both reid and kelly lost yesterday, seems ironic from my perspective. I never thought Reid was the problem and he sure did turn the chiefs around but kelly is doing the same thing in philly that reid did and I love to watch philly fans cry lol I don't hear their stupid eagles chant today!
One player in the Pro Bowl. Another two who were worthy. That's the extent of higher talent on this roster right now.
Top teams have players the opponent has to scheme to stop. That used to be CJ. Maybe Kendall Wright is that guy now. On defense, I see Casey as a guy who has to be doubled in pass-rushing situations but that's about the extent of it.
I think the Reid/Philly scenario was extremely similar to the late years of Fisher here. Were either of them terrible coaches? No. It was simply time to part ways.
completely agree here and I think health wise it was good for fisher, he had to have been burnt out of coaching by then. Coaches put in a lot of time during the week we do not see hence Kubiak falling down on the field.
Maybe I'm reading into it too much. Thanking "the Adams family" and not tommy smith himself seems like a slap in the face, to me. Tommy Smith gave him every chance to stick around and be opted out.
I'm not defending Munch. I thought he was an average coach. But if anyone thinks the Titans are going to be contenders with another coach without major roster improvements are dreaming, IMO.
I see a team a couple of season's away from being contenders IF they draft well and bring in the right free agents. Quality stability at the QB position is a must. Without that, I don't see the Titans as anything better than a one and done playoff team AT BEST.
I'd love to be wrong.
I remember quite a few of these same kinds of threads when Munch was hired. New coordinators to pull out CJ's potential, new attitude, etc.
Coaching is just one piece of the puzzle.
I'd never argue that we have some super talented roster. However, I don't think using Pro Bowl selections/consideration is a fair way to assess the situation. Plenty of very talented guys across the NFL didn't make the Pro Bowl. A player in the wrong scheme or not being put in a favorable position for success most likely isn't going to make the Pro Bowl, regardless of talent.
Just go back to the 2008 season when 3/4th of our secondary made the Pro Bowl and then the next season nobody made it. Did those guys suddenly become "untalented" from 2008 to 2009? No. They were the same guys but the talent around them substantially dwindled and as a result their performance/numbers suffered. Thus, no Pro Bowl.
Big Al was a big part of the reason. It was pretty obvious to most here at the time.
I'm not saying the Pro Bowl is everything. Look at All-Pro. Look at Football Outsiders. Look at any reputable source who evaluates talent.
I pretty much agree with this. Coaching is just a piece of the puzzle. But a pretty huge piece IMHO. Second only to QB.
The one point I disagree with is that we're necessarily "a couple seasons away" from being contenders. A quality QB can do wonders. I think if we get a legit QB in here then suddenly this "untalented roster" will look pretty darn talented.
I read that as Smith being part if the Adams family.
This is true. But you can draft ask the talent in the world, I for isn't being developed and used correctly, it is wasted. That was happening here, in the ol and lb corps in particular.
I know you don't consider "pro-bowl" indicative of talent. Also, scheme is a BIG component of who the public will vote for as well as the number of wins. We'll see what a fresh perspective can do with this roster (minus some of our better talent).
How is that (getting beat early) relevant? You're whole argument just collapsed on itself because Foles wasn't the unquestioned starter this year either. Vick was named starter and Foles had to take the job from him due to injuries.
That team had the most pro bowlers in the NFL, maybe the old coach was just that bad..
Dude, what are you talking about? The Eagles started the season with Vick as the starter because he was the starter before Kelly got there and he was presumed to be a better fit for Chip's system. With Vick at the helm the Eagles were getting smashed and some were already questioning if Kelly's system was to blame due to the high volume of plays he ran and the fact that many saw it as a gimmick. Had Vick stayed the starter chances are the Eagles would have been terrible and Chip would have been laughed at for his "college" system that doesn't work in the NFL.
Luckily for them Vick got hurt which thrust Foles into the starting spot. Foles proceeded to take the league by storm under the exact same system that Chip was already running and seemed poised for failure. The point is that the QB makes the coach not the other way around. Your argument is that the coaching change in Philly is what led to their success, I argue that the emergence of Foles which happened purely by accident and no one saw coming is what ultimately made the difference. If Chip was such a genius why wasn't Foles the unquestioned starter from the get-go? Why did it take the starter getting hurt for him to get his shot? Not sure how my argument "collapsed in on itself" since I've been pretty consistent in my statements but whatever.
Wait. I thought only good coaching produces good players. You saying Pro Bowl (quality) talent makes for a better team?
Thanks for proving my point.
Why is it so hard for you to understand it's both?
Munchak had talent here, and couldn't win. He's a bad head coach, he displayed that by going 3-20 vs winning teams, losing to 0-7, 0-8, and 0-13 teams, his divisional record, and losing winnable games that kept us out of the playoffs (up 17-3 at home vs Cincinnati etc..)
Big Al was THE reason. He and Vanden Bosch wouldn't let QB's breathe that year.
lol. So Munchak gets 3 seasons for people to accept he's a bad coach, and you pegged Chip Kelly in his first 6 games?
It was a new coach with a new system and they started slow. Shocker. Vick's stats were up btw, so once again you're argument has no base. That system had the Eagles breaking franchise records. Not sure why you're trying to discredit Kelly.
The Eagles entire offense played a lot better this year than last year, Lesean McCoy especially.
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